Transcript of the Hearing 16 September 2013


                                                Monday, 16 September 2013

           4   MR UNDERWOOD:  Thank you very much.

           5   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  That's what I will do.  I will rise

           6       now so 2 o'clock, please, then.

           7   (12.48 pm)

           8                     (The short adjournment)

           9   (2.00 pm)

          10   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  If I just indicate that as far as

          11       the order that I made respecting publicity under

          12       section 4(2) is concerned, that continues.  I will

          13       review its operation next Monday at 2.00 pm.

          14           But as far as these proceedings now, these are now

          15       open and public proceedings, to which no restriction

          16       order applies.  Everything is now open and can be

          17       published and I will now propose to ask the jury panel

          18       to come into court to go through the selection

          19       procedures and then there will be a short break at the

          20       conclusion of that if anything needs to be raised at

          21       that point.

          22           So I will ask the jury panel be invited to come in

          23       and take their seats at the back of court.

          24             (The JURY IN WAITING entered the court)

          25   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Thank you all very much.  Just all




           1       have a seat for the moment and I will have a few

           2       remarks, if I may, addressed to you, after which then

           3       a certain number of you will then be called forward into

           4       the jury box, which is that area there, as you can see

           5       in court here.

           6           Firstly, let me apologise to you all that you have

           7       been waiting around this morning for a while.  These

           8       things do happen.  Sometimes all the best timetables

           9       that lawyers put forward sometimes do get altered

          10       a little bit, as some of you will find out as we go on

          11       with this hearing.  I do apologise for that but I am

          12       pleased that you are all here now and that we can now

          13       proceed to empanel some of you on this jury.

          14           I know that in advance of this you have been

          15       summonsed here by the coroner's court in north London to

          16       sit on this Inquest and that, with the information that

          17       you were sent, was the indication then that this is

          18       likely to be a hearing which will require you to sit

          19       here for eight to ten weeks.  I know that you have been

          20       warned about that and that some of the people who have

          21       particular qualifying excusals have been able to put

          22       those forward.

          23           I hope the length of time of this Inquest is not

          24       a difficulty.  But as I have already indicated, and

          25       I think you have been told by the jury bailiffs that you




           1       have had the advantage certainly of being able to put

           2       down on a piece of paper any other further reasons that

           3       you may feel would cause difficulties.  Please, you can

           4       pass those to me if your number is called in due course.

           5           There are some further questions that I must now put

           6       to you and I will do that so that you can write these

           7       down if you wish to, or indeed you can raise them in

           8       court here in due course if your number is called and

           9       you are asked to come forward.

          10           The jury questions that we have all agreed that

          11       should be asked of you all are these:

          12           Do you have, or have you had, any direct connection

          13       with the Metropolitan Police Service, the Independent

          14       Police Complaints Commission or the Serious Organised

          15       Crime Agency?

          16           So any direct connection with the Metropolitan

          17       Police Service, the Independent Police Complaints

          18       Commission or the Serious Organised Crime Agency.

          19           The second matter: do you have or have you had any

          20       direct connection with Mark Duggan's family or did you

          21       at any time know Mark Duggan?

          22           Again, if that is the case that you have, or you

          23       believe you have, then you must let me know, please.

          24           The third question: do you have, or have you had,

          25       any direct connection with anyone or any business which




           1       suffered during the incidents in London in August and

           2       September 2011.

           3           So direct connection.  Obviously, many of you will

           4       have had some knowledge, connection -- memory of it but

           5       direct connection with anyone or a business that

           6       suffered as a result of the incidents in August and

           7       September 2011.

           8           So those are the formal questions.  What will happen

           9       in due course is that I will ask the counsel to the

          10       Inquest to read out the names of the witnesses.  But

          11       I think probably the best thing for us to do is to go to

          12       the stage now where 11 and then 2 -- so 13 -- are asked

          13       to come forward and then at that stage I shall ask him

          14       to read out the names of those witnesses who are likely

          15       to be giving evidence, just in case those names should

          16       be familiar to you and you think you know them or you

          17       have some connection with them.

          18           So thank you very much for your attention so far.

          19       What we will do now is I will hand you over to the clerk

          20       of the court who will then at random select the numbers

          21       which I know you all know which number you all are.

          22       Let's see how it goes.

          23                       Selection of JURORS

          24   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  Members of the jury in waiting,

          25       I shall now ballot for the jury.  When I call your




           1       number, please answer and go to the jury seats and sit

           2       down in the order in which you are called.

           3           35.

           4   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  You sir, would you like to come

           5       forward then, please.

           6   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  36.  37.  38.

           7   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Let me just see, I have a note.

           8       (Pause)

           9           Thank you very much, [number] 37.  I think that, in

          10       those circumstances, I will excuse you from attendance

          11       on this Inquest.  Thank you very much for letting me

          12       know.  So if you would like to return back, I will hold

          13       onto that and then we will ask [person] who is number

          14       38, if you would move to your right, then we will ask

          15       another number to come forward to sit in that seat.

          16       Thank you.

          17   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  15.

          18           13.

          19           16.

          20  (Discussion between THE CLERK OF THE COURT and THE ASSISTANT

          21                             CORONER)

          22   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  I think [they] should stand down.

          23       Thank you very much then, that's the [person] who is

          24       number 13.  Thank you very much.

          25           Sorry to call you numbers that's rather impersonal,




           1       I'll tell you about that in a moment.  Let's press on.

           2   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  46.  4.  6.  47.  19.  20.

           3   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  I have a note from number 19.  Thank

           4       you very much.  Let's have a look at that, thank you.

           5       (Pause)

           6           Sorry to see that.  In which case, yes, the [person]

           7       who's just been called and handed in this letter can now

           8       be excused.  I am just trying to -- number 19, isn't

           9       it -- whoever sent me the letter.  I have a number 47

          10       written on the top of it.  That's from you, is it?  You

          11       as number 47 may now be excused.

          12           So if the [person] who is number 19 or 20 can remain

          13       there -- I have a note from the person at number 20.

          14       Thank you.  (Pause)

          15           No, for very good reason, thank you very much, yes,

          16       you may be released.  Thank you, number 20.

          17   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  22.  23.  24.  25.

          18           (A note was handed to THE ASSISTANT CORONER)

          19   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  22.

          20   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Thank you very much.

          21           Yes, I understand that.  Thank you very much.  So

          22       the lady number 22 may be released.  Thank you.

          23   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  26.

          24   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Let's see if there are any other --

          25   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  Number 23.  (Handed) (Pause)




           1   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Yes.  I understand and I thank the

           2       company for writing in and I think in the circumstances

           3       I will excuse juror number 23 from service, thank you

           4       very much.

           5   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  27.  (Pause)

           6   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Thank you all very much.  Now, the

           7       next stage -- we go carefully stage by stage but we are

           8       getting there and thank you very much for coming forward

           9       into the jury box, is for me to call upon

          10       Mr Ashley Underwood QC who's going to read out the names

          11       of witnesses who are named who are going to be giving

          12       evidence hopefully from that witness box, just to make

          13       sure there's no one there who may be your neighbour or

          14       somebody you know.

          15           So concentrate and I will also ask those at the back

          16       also to concentrate in case anyone does know a name you

          17       might be called forward to take the place of that juror.

          18       So I will ask Mr Underwood to do that now.

          19   MR UNDERWOOD:  Good afternoon.  It's quite a lengthy list

          20       I'm afraid.  For good reason, a number of witnesses on

          21       here are only going to be known by their initials so

          22       it's going to be a bit of a guessing game so I will try

          23       and explain who those who have been initialled may be.

          24           The first on the list is Mohammad Ali he worked in

          25       a taxi office in Hoxton Cars Limited in August 2011.




           1           The next witness is Christopher Allen, who was

           2       a uniformed police officer.

           3           Next is Gary Arkless who was another police officer.

           4           There's a Mohammad Asif who also worked in Hoxton

           5       Cars Limited in August 2011.

           6           We then have a number of officers who worked in

           7       a part of the Metropolitan Police called SCD11.

           8       I cannot give you their names.  SCD11 is the

           9       surveillance team, so if any of you who knowingly know

          10       of police officers who may have been in that police

          11       surveillance team then that's who they may be.

          12           Next is Michael Barber, a police officer who came

          13       and tested a pistol found in August 2011.

          14           Then there's a paramedic called April Barter.

          15           Next is a Metropolitan Police officer who worked in

          16       the Hackney area called Detective Sergeant

          17       Andrew Belfield.

          18           Next is a forensic scientist called Andrew Bell.

          19           Then Nicholas Bennett who was an officer working --

          20       police officer working in the Metropolitan Police,

          21       giving tactical advice.

          22           Then there is a civilian called Darren Biggs who

          23       lived around the Tottenham area.

          24           Then a uniformed officer called Stephen Boswell.

          25           A gun shot residue expert called Mark Bowden.




           1           Another paramedic from north London called

           2       David Brennecke.

           3           Then an imagery expert, that is somebody who tested

           4       DVDs who we will be hearing from in due course, called

           5       Clive Burchett.

           6           A lady witness Z, who's another

           7       civilian at the scene.

           8           Next another police officer who attended the scene,

           9       he's called Paul Christiansen.

          10           Then we come to an orthopaedic surgeon called

          11       Jonathan Clasper.

          12           Then Luke Clow, another civilian who was at the

          13       scene.

          14           A crime scene manager working with the Metropolitan

          15       Police called John Cockram.

          16           Then a very senior police officer called

          17       Stuart Cundy.

          18           Somebody who worked for a car pound in Perivale

          19       called David Cunningham.

          20           Another police officer who worked for operation

          21       Trident called Paul Dempsey.

          22           Then we come to two firearms officers -- firearms

          23       instructors, I should say, for the Metropolitan Police

          24       Service, Simon Dobinson and Shaun Dowe.

          25           Then a civilian at the scene called Emil Drzewiecki.




           1           Then there's a relative of Mr Duggan called

           2       Marlon Duggan, that's Mark Duggan's brother.

           3           Another police officer, working for the armed

           4       service of it, that's called Brian Elliott.

           5           Then Kieran Ely O'Carroll, who's a civilian who was

           6       at the scene.

           7           A police officer working as a post incident manager

           8       called Neil Evans.

           9           Another of the police officers in Hackney area who

          10       did some detective work on this called Detective

          11       Constable Steve Faulkner.

          12           A specialist search officer for the police service

          13       called Paul Fitzgibbon.

          14           Then a Trident police officer who was the senior

          15       investigating officer for the operation we are

          16       discussing here; he's called Mick Foote.

          17           There's a specialist in drugs analysis called

          18       Alexander Forrest.

          19           Another CO19 -- that is armed police -- officer,

          20       called Jim Fowler.

          21           There's another police officer from the Hackney area

          22       called Lloyd Gardner.

          23           A further armed police officer who attended the

          24       scene called Dan Gibson.

          25           There's a doctor who came in the helicopter




           1       emergency service called William Glazebrook.

           2           A recovery driver called Nicholas Goldsmith, who

           3       picked up a minicab after this and took it away from the

           4       scene.

           5           Then another couple of civilians at the scene.  One

           6       is Norman Grodentz, then Nino Hamadouche.

           7           There's a searcher from the Metropolitan Police

           8       specialist search team called Christopher Hannigan.

           9           Another civilian at the seen called Finbar Hanrahan.

          10           A policeman who attended the scene, Steve Hartshorn.

          11           Again, a very senior police officer who is involved

          12       in this called DAC Hewitt.

          13           Another recovery driver who picked up the minicab

          14       called Colin Hodge.

          15           Another police officer who dealt with the gun here

          16       called Gareth Hughes.

          17           A gentleman who's alleged to have provided the gun

          18       to Mr Duggan called Kevin Hutchinson-Foster.

          19           Then an IPCC investigator called Gareth Jones.

          20       I will in due course explain what the IPCC is.

          21           A forensic scientist called Saranjeet Kehra.

          22           Another IPCC investigator called David Kirkpatrick.

          23           A finger print analyst called Jacqueline Landais.

          24           A crime scene manager for the police called

          25       Patricia Larrigan.




           1           Another police officer in the directorate of

           2       professional standards called Katie Lilburn, she's

           3       a detective inspector.

           4           A senior police officer, the strategic firearms

           5       commander for this firearms operation, called

           6       Fiona Mallon, a superintendent.

           7           A staff member of a car pound in Perivale where the

           8       minicab was take called Paul Martin.

           9           A civilian at the scene called Valentine McGuire.

          10           A police officer from Durham who acts as

          11       an independent expert called Helen McMilan.

          12           There is a further gentleman who worked in the taxi

          13       office who is called Ajaz Mir.

          14           There is another searcher, police searcher, who

          15       attended the scene called Paula Mugglestone.

          16           A post-incident manager who attended called

          17       Tony Nash.

          18           Yet another specialist search officer called

          19       Scott Nicholls.

          20           Another civilian at the scene called

          21       Richard Nobel-Thompson.

          22           Then a further crime scene manager called

          23       Malcolm Nott.

          24           Anne-Marie O'Connor, who is a forensic scientist.

          25           Richard Omotosho, another IPCC investigator.




           1           Jonathan Orford, who's a further crime scene

           2       examiner.

           3           Jonathan Payne, who's a police exhibits officer.

           4           Simon Poole, who's a pathologist.

           5           Andrew Postlethwaite, who analysed some gun shot

           6       wounds.

           7           A pathologist called Derrick Pounder.

           8           Then there are a number of firearms officers working

           9       for the Metropolitan Police who won't give their names

          10       for very good reasons and, again, if you know anybody

          11       who is a firearms officer for the police and who may

          12       have been involved in operations in August, then at the

          13       moment the best I can do is say they may be included in

          14       these unnamed people.

          15           Then there's Steven Rainford who is a specialist

          16       search officer.

          17           I'm two thirds of the way through.

          18           A gentleman called Gary Rennles, another one of the

          19       CO19 armed officers who attended the scene.

          20           A finger print officer -- a specialist rather,

          21       called Ian Richards.

          22           An exhibits officer called Rachel Samuel.

          23           A duty officer at Haringey Police called

          24       Caroline Saunders, who's an inspector.

          25           A forensic scientist called Philip Seaman.




           1           Another forensic scientist who analysed gunshot

           2       residue called Angela Shaw.

           3           There's a toxicologist called John Slaughter.

           4           Next there's a David Suddick, who's another senior

           5       officer in the Hackney area.

           6           Peter Suggett, who's another police officer who

           7       attended the scene.

           8           David Thorne is an imagery expert.

           9           Then Franco Tomei, who's a ballistics expert.

          10           Then there is Desmond Vanhinsbergh, who's another

          11       forensic expert.  He analysed the DNA.

          12           Michael Vaughan, who is a ballistics expert.

          13           Harry Waddingham, who's another of the armed

          14       officers, who is named, who attended the scene

          15       afterwards.

          16           Simon Ward, who's another crime scene examiner.

          17           Danny Warner, a uniformed officer who attended the

          18       scene.

          19           Steve Williams, another DPS officer -- Department of

          20       Professional Standards officer -- who attended later on.

          21           Those are the named and generically unnamed officers

          22       and if after an exhaustive list any of those are known

          23       to you or you think might be known to you, that could be

          24       relevant.

          25   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Thank you very much, Mr Underwood.




           1       I'm sorry that was a long and rather daunting list but

           2       I hope you are able to hear that and you can let me know

           3       if there's anyone there who you know, because what will

           4       happen now is that we will now proceed on to swear the

           5       first 11 of you.  A jury at an Inquest consists of

           6       a maximum of 11 people and we have asked two extras to

           7       come along -- they won't be sworn in now -- but just in

           8       case, having heard the opening, something arises and we

           9       might need one or both of you.

          10           So what will happen now is that we will swear in the

          11       first 11 of you who have been asked to come forward.

          12           So thank you very much.  You will hear the

          13       instructions from the clerk of the court.

          14                     Swearing in of THE JURY

          15   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  Members of the jury, when I call

          16       your number, please stand, take the book in your raised

          17       hand and read the oath aloud from the card.  When you

          18       have finished please sit down.

          19           35.

          20                         (JUROR 35 sworn)

          21   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  36.

          22                         (JUROR 36 sworn)

          23   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  38.

          24                         (JUROR 38 sworn)

          25   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  15.




           1                       (JUROR 15 affirmed)

           2   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  16.

           3                         (JUROR 16 sworn)

           4   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  46.

           5                         (JUROR 46 sworn)

           6   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  4.

           7                         (JUROR 4 sworn)

           8   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  6.

           9                        (JUROR 6 affirmed)

          10   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  19.

          11                       (JUROR 19 affirmed)

          12   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  24.

          13                       (JUROR 24 affirmed)

          14   THE CLERK OF THE COURT:  25.

          15                       (JUROR 25 affirmed)

          16   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Thank you very much.  Right, thank

          17       you.  In which case, as the other two who are there know

          18       that you are potentially part of the jury and you will

          19       please be with us for the opening of the case in due

          20       course.

          21           Now, what should happen now, and can I just enquire

          22       really of the court officials?  As you know, we are here

          23       in court 73, up in court 76 above is a live video and

          24       audio feed for the press and other members of the

          25       public.  I have a screen here to make sure everyone is




           1       behaving up in court 76; that's just gone blank so

           2       I just feel someone ought to know.  I really hope that

           3       they can hear what's going on up there but please

           4       whoever is dealing with this could they ensure that

           5       I get that screen back as soon as possible.

           6           But what will happen now, we will have a very short

           7       break.  But firstly, let me turn my attentions to those

           8       who are still seated at the back of court.  I repeat, if

           9       I may, the apology for you having to wait around this

          10       morning.  Can I thank you very much for coming in today

          11       and very much being prepared to do your duty, as

          12       a citizen, and it's a difficult duty because it can take

          13       quite some time, as you have heard from the witness list

          14       being read out, but I am pleased you have been able to

          15       come along and respond to your jury summons and come

          16       today ready to do that.

          17           But it's quite apparent now that we now no longer

          18       need you as jurors in this matter.  I am not absolutely

          19       sure whether that means you are free to go completely

          20       from any jury service anywhere or whether you may be

          21       required for a week or two in some other court centre

          22       but certainly, as far as we're concerned here, that

          23       concludes you responding to your jury summons to come

          24       here and, as far as this court is concerned, you are

          25       free to go and do whatever else it was that you were




           1       going to be doing tomorrow somewhere in London, no

           2       doubt.

           3           Anyway, can I thank you very much for coming along

           4       and for the inconvenience that that's caused.  But thank

           5       you for attending and if you would like to go now with

           6       the jury bailiffs they will be able to deal with you and

           7       let you know.

           8        (The jurors who were not selected left the court)

           9   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Let me now just address a few

          10       remarks to the 13 of you who are here.

          11           Let me tell you what's in store for you today.

          12           What will happen is that we'll just have a short

          13       break of five or ten minutes, allowing you to go back

          14       into what will now become your jury room which will be

          15       your home for the next few weeks.  After you have been

          16       down there, that will allow me to open up the back there

          17       of the court for members of the press and members of

          18       Mr Duggan's family, if they wish to be here, and any

          19       other members of the public.  So that's a practical

          20       arrangement.

          21           Then we will sit this afternoon.  What will happen

          22       for the remainder of the afternoon, and it won't

          23       hopefully be for too long, will be that I will begin the

          24       opening of the case to you, telling you some legal

          25       directions and giving you some warnings that I have to




           1       do at the beginning of the case.

           2           Then, that, as I say, will not go on for too long

           3       hopefully, and that will conclude the proceedings for

           4       this afternoon.  Then I will be asking you to come back

           5       tomorrow morning at 10.30 and then you will be hearing

           6       the rest of the opening delivered by Mr Ashley Underwood

           7       who's just been speaking to you, really outlining the

           8       evidence that's going to be called in this trial.

           9           As you have already heard me say, we do have two

          10       [people] there who have not yet been sworn in.  This is

          11       not an invitation to you but just in case, and this does

          12       sometimes happen in long trials, that you may get home

          13       tonight and realise that some reason or another which is

          14       a good reason, means that you will be unable to sit for

          15       eight to ten weeks on this jury.

          16           Then if that is the case, tomorrow please come along

          17       with that reason being written down on a piece of paper

          18       so I can see it.  It's a personal thing between you

          19       and I.  We work together as a team.  You are the jury,

          20       I am the judge or coroner and what goes between you

          21       and I is personal, we do not disseminate it to the

          22       lawyers.

          23           So if there are some good reasons why you feel that

          24       you will not be able to sit, then tomorrow morning or by

          25       the end of the opening will be a good time because when




           1       we start hearing evidence that's when I have to say to

           2       the other two on the jury that -- to thank them and that

           3       they are not required on the jury but at the moment they

           4       have not yet escaped.  So it may be that that will be

           5       tomorrow or it may be slightly later.  But we will have

           6       to see.

           7           So what I am going to ask now then is if you would

           8       like to go with the jury bailiffs, I would normally give

           9       a warning, please don't discuss the case but you haven't

          10       heard anything about the case, and I'll be able to give

          11       you all the warnings in a moment.

          12           So please do nothing more than go with the jury

          13       bailiffs, then you will come back through this door.  Do

          14       not worry about entering the court by a different door.

          15       I will explain all that in due course.  If you would

          16       like to leave us now for a short time.

          17                   (In the absence of the jury)

          18   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Thank you.  Just before I rise, as

          19       I will do for a very short moment before I then start

          20       the opening.  I did sound out to see whether I was to be

          21       invited or requested to have a short moment of silence

          22       in the view of the nature of this enquiry.  I have

          23       received encouragement to do so but I understand that

          24       that's not fully supported.  Would this be the time you

          25       might want to say anything Mr Stern?




           1   MR STERN:  Yes, sir, it may be.  May I say straight away

           2       that I feel obviously that it's something that I raise

           3       with a degree of reluctance but I do so nevertheless.

           4           Can I say straight away that I understand the

           5       sentiment, and of course every death in these

           6       circumstances is both tragic and unwanted.  I understand

           7       the feelings of the family and may I say that straight

           8       away so nobody misunderstands what lies behind what I am

           9       submitting?

          10           This is of course an Inquest and there are a number

          11       of issues, some difficult issues, to determine.  It is

          12       very important that all interested persons and the jury

          13       understand that those issues will be looked at openly

          14       and without emotion.

          15           The proposal, in my submission, is, I'm afraid, the

          16       antithesis of that and it is also something that has not

          17       been done, in my experience, for the coroner to

          18       undertake a period of silence in that regard.  That does

          19       not of course mean that it cannot be done and I am not

          20       suggesting --

          21   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  I have heard it being done.

          22   MR STERN:  Then our experiences are different; that's all

          23       I can say.

          24           There is absolutely no difficulty in, sir, you

          25       expressing sympathy to the family and expressing that in




           1       any way that you see appropriate, and expressing it on

           2       behalf of everyone here.  Nobody could complain about

           3       that and I wouldn't seek to do that.  But anything else

           4       could be seen as a sense of pressure upon the jury and

           5       that is something I know that you will want to avoid.

           6       In addition to which, it could be misinterpreted by

           7       officers.  I won't say anymore about that because, as

           8       you will appreciate, there is of course a version of

           9       events as to what happened, that that does not

          10       necessarily accord with what may or may not be some of

          11       the media attention that has been put out there.

          12   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  All right.  Thank you very much.

          13       Sorry to put you in a difficult position on that.

          14           I am not going to ask for thoughts from others.  But

          15       I think that I will deal with it in a perhaps lower key

          16       way than I might otherwise have dealt with that.  But

          17       I will ask everyone at one point just to remain silent

          18       for a short time but I won't have the dramatic standing

          19       up or anything of that nature so we'll see how I deal

          20       with it in due course.

          21           All right, thank you very much.  I will just rise to

          22       allow this court to be set up and my screens to be

          23       repaired and take it from there.  Thank you very much.

          24   (2.43 pm)

          25                         (A short break)




           1   (3.00 pm)

           2   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  I will ask then for the jury to be

           3       brought into court, please.  (Pause)

           4                  (In the presence of the jury)

           5         Opening of the Inquest by THE ASSISTANT CORONER

           6   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Thank you very much, members of the

           7       jury, I'm sorry, we'll get a better set up system going

           8       once we go under way with this hearing.

           9           Let me just this afternoon begin the opening, which

          10       I should and must and want to give you in relation to

          11       this hearing, that you and I are really going to be

          12       taking part together as a team, but you and I have

          13       separate roles.

          14           Let me just firstly explain, as I have already said,

          15       that I have asked two extra members of the panel to

          16       remain with the 11 of you of the jury, in case any

          17       matter arises over the next day, which means that one or

          18       two of the 11 chosen, if they are in genuine

          19       difficulties, then obviously we can deal with it as the

          20       case may be.

          21           Let me address you all as members of the jury.  Let

          22       me say to you that you have now been sworn as the jury

          23       in the Inquest into the death of Mark Wayne Duggan.  He

          24       died on 4 August 2011.

          25           You are the jury and I am the coroner.  As you can




           1       see, the coroners -- Inquest takes place without robes

           2       on.  We are here and will be based in this court room

           3       for some time.

           4           An Inquest is a very different form of hearing from

           5       other cases in other courts because nobody is on trial,

           6       no organisation is on trial.  You, as the jury of 11,

           7       will not be deciding any questions of civil or criminal

           8       liability.

           9           At the centre of the hearing is the concentration on

          10       the tragedy, which is the regrettable loss of a young

          11       life.  It's right that you should know that present in

          12       court today are a number of Mark Duggan's family and

          13       friends, and to acknowledge the grief of those family

          14       and friends, and to respect that loss, we will just

          15       together have some moments of silence as we sit here to

          16       recognise the seriousness of the hearing which we are

          17       about to undertake.

          18                        (Silence in court)

          19   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  Thank you.  As I have already said,

          20       we are not looking at questions of civil or criminal

          21       liability so what is it that we are about on behalf of

          22       the family and on behalf of the State?

          23           Well, it's a quest to find the truth.  This may

          24       sound rather grand, but it is, in fact, an important

          25       task and one which may take us a little time.  You will




           1       not have to decide on the truth of everything that

           2       happened involving Mark Duggan and various police

           3       officers on that fateful day, but you will be needing to

           4       decide key matters.

           5           So let me now set out how the law sees your role in

           6       this Inquest.

           7           The role of a jury really comes into the four words

           8       which is: who; when; where; how.

           9           The first is to decide who.  There won't be any

          10       difficulties about that because the deceased was indeed

          11       Mark Wayne Duggan, and that is clear.

          12           When?  You will be told that the likely time of

          13       death would be shortly after 6.00 pm, perhaps 6.15 pm,

          14       on 4 August 2011.

          15           Where did he come by his death?  That again will not

          16       be very much in contention.  He died on the pavement of

          17       Ferry Lane in Tottenham north London at that time.

          18           The fourth one is: how did he come by his death?

          19       The actual cause of death is not very much itself in

          20       dispute.  It is clear that he died as a result of being

          21       shot by an armed police officer who was at the scene.

          22       But the word "how" also requires you, the jury, to

          23       enquire into and decide not only the means of death but

          24       the surrounding circumstances in which he came by his

          25       death.




           1           It will also be your task to record the particulars

           2       concerning the death as required by the statute, the

           3       Registration Act but do not worry about this at this

           4       stage, I will tell you more about this towards the end

           5       of the Inquest.

           6           So this is an Inquest in which you, the jury, are

           7       playing the central role of deciding the facts.

           8           It is not a public inquiry, as such, where a judge

           9       or selected panel of people decide the facts.  This

          10       Inquest is subject to the usual rules governing a court

          11       of law.  Some public enquiries are televisised for

          12       example, some deal with wide ranging issues and often

          13       they result in long written reports setting out all

          14       sorts of various findings.  But here that's not the

          15       case.

          16           This is an Inquest.  This is a court of law.  The

          17       cameras that you see around are not broadcasting

          18       television out to the world, they are merely recording

          19       for use in the court room upstairs for those members of

          20       the public and press who are unable to fit into this

          21       court 73.

          22           After my opening remarks, and this will happen now

          23       tomorrow, the evidence will be opened by Mr Ashley

          24       Underwood to you, and then in due course he, as counsel

          25       to the Inquest, will be calling the witnesses into that




           1       witness box right in front of you here.

           2           At an early stage in the hearing -- and this is now

           3       scheduled for Thursday -- you will have a view of the

           4       scene that we are concentrating on.  Indeed, it will be

           5       a view of two areas, and the reason for that will be

           6       given to you tomorrow when Mr Underwood opens the case.

           7       But that will happen on Thursday because what I do not

           8       want you to do is all go off and do your own research,

           9       as I'll be saying to you in a moment.  So it's very

          10       important that at an early stage we will go and look at

          11       the scene, because that will better inform you as you

          12       hear the evidence about what happened there.

          13           So when witnesses are called, it's a matter for you

          14       to decide whether you wish to make notes.  I notice as

          15       soon as you sat down, notes were put before you.  You

          16       don't have to write anything down at all, or you may

          17       want to write things down.  In fact, the evidence, as it

          18       happens, will be transcribed and will be available for

          19       you electronically on the Inquest website and you will

          20       be given details as to how to access the website later

          21       on.  You can do that and you will find the transcripts

          22       of the evidence there.

          23           What is important, I am not saying you can just sit

          24       back and say "Don't worry about this, I'll think about

          25       something else and I'll read it tomorrow on the




           1       website"; that will obviously be wrong.  But I do not

           2       want you to be buried with your heads in your notebooks

           3       writing down every note that you hear from the witness

           4       box, thinking "Have I got that right or not", because

           5       there will be that available for you to look at.

           6           So by far the most important task for you is for you

           7       to see, as well as hear, the witnesses.  You will need

           8       to assess them for truthfulness and for accuracy, how

           9       reliable, how much weight can you put on their evidence.

          10       There will be experts who will give evidence and you

          11       will need to decide what weight to be given to their

          12       opinions.  But this isn't a legal process which will be

          13       decided by experts.  Those experts are simply giving

          14       evidence to assist you to come to your decisions because

          15       the decision or decisions are for you and for you alone.

          16           Clearly, as I say, we want to help you as much as

          17       possible through the access of the evidence, as I have

          18       said, and indeed by you having the witnesses completely

          19       in front.  It's only when you have heard all the

          20       evidence that you will then be in a position to make

          21       conclusive findings of fact and draw conclusions from

          22       those findings if safe to do so.

          23           So please wait until the end of the evidence before

          24       you start doing that.  It will be going on over a number

          25       of weeks, I am not saying that you must meet in the




           1       morning and not talk about anything at all, but please

           2       be very, very careful, just to sit back, don't worry

           3       because you haven't heard anything, and the first few

           4       witnesses -- first of all you may think it a little bit

           5       confusing, it may take quite some time before the

           6       picture of the jigsaw puzzle begins to be put together

           7       to see what conclusions you can safely draw from the

           8       evidence as presented to you.

           9           Not only that, at the end of the evidence, it's my

          10       task, and my duty, to sum up the case to you.  This will

          11       involve giving you directions on the law, which, please,

          12       you will take from me and apply to direct your

          13       consideration of the evidence.  As I keep saying, and

          14       will be said many times, but it bears repeating: the

          15       evidence of course is for you and not for me but I must

          16       review it with you and I will be able to do that knowing

          17       that you have access to it either electronically or

          18       indeed in hard copy form.

          19           At that stage, I will then go through with you

          20       available verdicts and other questions to be answered

          21       then.  I am not going to anticipate by going through the

          22       law in relation to coroners and Inquests at this stage.

          23           But it's right for you to realise fully that you

          24       will not be deciding, as I say -- again, you will be

          25       hearing this again -- criminal or civil liabilities.




           1       But, having said that, it may be the case that at the

           2       heart of your considerations will be whether Mark Duggan

           3       was killed lawfully or unlawfully.  There is no dispute

           4       that Mark Duggan sadly died as a result of a bullet

           5       fired by a police officer.  You will hear evidence from

           6       that officer.  He has no burden of proof in this

           7       Inquest.  However, he clearly will be a crucial witness,

           8       and we will no doubt all listen with particular care to

           9       his explanations for his actions.

          10           I will in due course, as I say, give you full and

          11       written directions to follow in considering your

          12       verdicts or verdict but I thought it was right at this

          13       onset to highlight what may be seen to be quite

          14       an important and central part of the Inquest and your

          15       search for the truth.

          16           I want to apologise now if I sound a little bit too

          17       strict or if I seem to be repeating directions and

          18       warnings.  I am going to have to do that from time to

          19       time.  I'm sure you understand that I must give you

          20       certain warnings, as I'm required to do so by law, and

          21       it's very important for me and you to comply with what

          22       is expected of us in this very serious and important

          23       hearing.

          24           So let me turn to particular warnings which are said

          25       to jurors when they sit in the Crown Court as well as




           1       jurors sitting on Inquests, but they are very, very

           2       important warnings that I'm sure you will take very much

           3       to heart.

           4           You each have taken an oath or affirmation to try

           5       the case on the evidence.  You should consider

           6       yourselves bound by such oath or affirmation but what is

           7       the true effect of that oath or affirmation?

           8           Well, firstly, the word that had you all started

           9       saying at the beginning of that was the word "I".  So

          10       that means that the responsibility to try the case, and

          11       to reach the verdict, is on you, the 11 people who said

          12       "I", no one else.  What does that mean?  Please

          13       therefore do not discuss the case with anyone else

          14       outside that number of 11.  Whilst your full and

          15       informed discussion should only begin in earnest once

          16       you have heard all the evidence, please if there are

          17       discussions before then, whatever happens it must only

          18       be between the 11 of you when you are together in

          19       private in your jury room.

          20           So that means, please, you must not discuss the

          21       evidence or the case with other people.  So whilst you

          22       may of course let those at home or work know that for

          23       the present you are performing your civic duty as

          24       a juror, please do not go into any further detail and

          25       please feel free to blame me, I get blamed for all sorts




           1       of things and you can please say look the coroner or the

           2       judge has told us that we are not to discuss it, and

           3       that's very important for you to do that.

           4           There's an important aspect of this too, especially

           5       these days, that it's very important for you not to

           6       broadcast your thoughts on Facebook or Twitter or any

           7       other social media so please, I do not want you to do

           8       the first thing you do as you leave this court room this

           9       afternoon saying "Hey everybody, guess what I'm doing,

          10       I'm sitting on a jury" because that will only invite

          11       comments from other people who want to have their ten

          12       penny worth.

          13           Because this will be an interesting hearing.  There

          14       will be matters of importance for you to decide and hear

          15       from and I'm sure there will be people who want to tell

          16       you what they think about it all and we must not have

          17       that.  Not only are we not interested in what they have

          18       to say but please do not tell them, therefore, any

          19       details at all about what you're doing.  Just say

          20       "Terribly sorry, I'm on a jury at the moment and

          21       I cannot discuss it".  As I say you have been told to do

          22       that by the judge or coroner or whatever you want to

          23       call me.

          24           That's the first warning attached to the word "I".

          25           The second warning is you have promised to try the




           1       case on the evidence.  What is the evidence?  That

           2       brings me to the next important warning because evidence

           3       is what happens principally in this court room.  It

           4       includes the oral testimony, what the witness is going

           5       to be saying from that witness box.  There are going to

           6       be some written documents, there won't be that many but

           7       there will be some written documents and photographs and

           8       such like and there will be experts as well giving

           9       opinions.  That all happens in the court room and that

          10       will be evidence.  Your visit to the scene on Thursday,

          11       that's all part of the evidence and for your

          12       consideration as well.  But that is what you are

          13       deciding it on: what happens here and attached in that

          14       way.

          15           So it's very important for you to know what you

          16       therefore mustn't do, which is of course your own

          17       research.  Now I'm quite sure that you will be tempted

          18       immediately to go on the Internet or other sites and put

          19       in the name "Mark Duggan".  It's a perfectly natural

          20       human thing to do but I want you to resist that, please.

          21       It's very, very important that you do.

          22           Because there is quite an amount of material on the

          23       Internet and elsewhere about Mark Duggan, about this

          24       fatal matter that you are going to have to decide about,

          25       and about all the surrounding issues.  Please, some of




           1       that information is unreliable and inaccurate, much of

           2       it is comment and opinion, which we just don't want.

           3       None of it's really helpful or relevant to you in your

           4       new task.  Certainly what it isn't is it is not

           5       evidence.  It's not something which here all the 11 of

           6       you are listening to called by the barristers in this

           7       case.  So it really, really is important, please, for

           8       you not to do that.

           9           If, in fact, it comes to my notice that anyone is

          10       doing such research, I might have to stop the whole

          11       Inquest and start all over again with a new jury and you

          12       will understand that that would not only cause,

          13       obviously, great expense and inconvenience but would

          14       cause genuine distress to witnesses and the family and

          15       all those other people involved in this matter so it's

          16       very, very important, please, for that not to happen.

          17           So the important thing is please just concentrate on

          18       the evidence that's put before you.  We plan that we

          19       will have all the relevant evidence that we are able to

          20       get to put before you.  That's why there was quite

          21       a long list of witnesses.  Part of the duty of the

          22       search for the truth is for us to go out -- I say "us",

          23       that's myself and counsel and the team for the

          24       Inquest -- to see what we can find that might possibly

          25       help you.




           1           There will of course, during the course of this

           2       hearing, be some publicity and there will be and there

           3       is press interest.  Again, please be careful.  All that

           4       is not evidence.  I am not criticising the press, who

           5       are very helpful and useful on many occasions, but here

           6       it's very, very important.  The press is entitled to

           7       comment, and is entitled to publicise what's going on,

           8       it's all part of a free and open society.

           9           But often the press coverage is inevitable to be

          10       selective, it may not necessarily be impartial or

          11       complete and thus can present a view which is sometimes

          12       inaccurate.

          13           I am very keen these proceedings should be as

          14       transparent and open as possible, so I do not want to

          15       put any restrictions on the press saying what they wish

          16       within the press guidelines.

          17           I'm confident that the press will not wilfully

          18       misrepresent the evidence.  But mistakes can be made and

          19       really the truth of the matter about all of this is that

          20       you are the ones who will actually be hearing the

          21       evidence.  You have the front seats, you're positioned

          22       right there. you will be seeing the witnesses, much more

          23       than anybody else.  Whilst there will be comment about

          24       what some people have said, no doubt in the press, it's

          25       much better for you to ignore that because you are there




           1       right -- the best seats in the house, able to see the

           2       witnesses, able to come to your conclusions, it's your

           3       conclusions that matter not affected by anything else

           4       that you may have seen or read.

           5           So, please, remember that.  I'm sorry if I'm

           6       sounding like a grumpy headmaster going on with all

           7       these warnings but it is important for me to go through

           8       this for you at this stage.

           9           So, as I have said, please do not let anybody speak

          10       to you about this Inquest, whether it's in this building

          11       or travelling to and from, or whether you are at home or

          12       indeed even in your own neighbourhood.  If you have any

          13       serious concerns about anything which takes place, even

          14       within your own number, within the jury room, then

          15       please raise it with a written note through the usher to

          16       me.  As I say, I am the one -- if you have some real

          17       concerns write it down and let me know because the

          18       sooner any problem comes to me the sooner and better

          19       hopefully it can be resolved.

          20           So whilst you each heard the questions that I've

          21       asked of you and thus confirmed that you have no direct

          22       connection with the police or Mark Duggan's family, or

          23       indeed were not a victim of the London incidents, you

          24       will have some prior knowledge of some of the facts, I'm

          25       sure, and this is why it really highlights what I have




           1       to say.

           2           As an example, you have heard Mr Ashley Underwood

           3       mentioning a man called Mr Hutchinson-Foster.  Now, he

           4       was a man who stood trial, and indeed was eventually

           5       convicted of supplying a firearm to Mark Duggan on the

           6       day we are concerned with, on 4 August 2011.

           7           He is a man who's in fact in prison, but we plan to

           8       call him so that he can give his account of what he says

           9       on that day.  I will give legal directions in due course

          10       as to how you should approach that evidence, bearing in

          11       mind the conviction that he now has.

          12           However it is important for you to realise that

          13       there is a very great limitation on that conviction for

          14       that man.  We have to look at it in the context of the

          15       rest of the case.  You will need to consider a lot of

          16       material about the gun found at or near the scene of the

          17       shooting.  You will be directed and will need to come to

          18       your own conclusions about these matters, and what

          19       I have just mentioned about that conviction is just one

          20       part of the story.

          21           So now back to some general observations from me.

          22       All in all, it's vital that you are comfortable and able

          23       to concentrate on the evidence without worrying about

          24       any external factors.  So there is no mystery about it.

          25       I decided, as there are so many witnesses that are going




           1       to be called given their names and numbers without

           2       giving any details that we just simply don't need to

           3       know names and so I have decided, as happens in a number

           4       of other jury trials now, that everyone should just have

           5       a number so that's why you were given numbers.  There's

           6       nothing more sinister about it than that, because I want

           7       you not to worry about yourselves, I want you to worry

           8       about sitting there and concentrating and deciding on

           9       which reasons witnesses you are relying, which ones you

          10       think "Yes, that sounds truthful and I am not so sure

          11       about that piece of evidence or whatever it may be".

          12       I do not want you to be ill at ease at all.

          13           Also, sometimes, members of jurors in long cases can

          14       find that some things crop up in their personal lives.

          15       There may be an important medical appointment or sadly

          16       sometimes there may be a family funeral or something of

          17       that nature.  If there's something like that happens,

          18       I do not want you to be sitting there worrying about it,

          19       you write me a note and then I can arrange and say right

          20       we will not sit on that afternoon or whatever it may be

          21       and we will be able to work round that.  So I do not

          22       want you to be anxious about that.

          23           So the hearing timings, and that brings me on to

          24       that, are actually going to seem to you to be not

          25       particularly onerous but don't worry, they are long days




           1       and they are very tiring but, in fact, what happens is

           2       there's a lot of administrative work goes on over this

           3       side of the court are the legal teams who will be

           4       introduced to you tomorrow, they represent a number of

           5       people that we call interested parties who have interest

           6       in this hearing and they will be asking questions of

           7       witnesses in due course.

           8           So whilst around the hearing there are these legal

           9       matters, administrative matters to deal with, I have

          10       decided, in an effort to make sure that we concentrate

          11       and use your time as best we can, that we will have

          12       a sitting pattern which in the normal week -- let's say

          13       what next week is going to be -- we will start on Monday

          14       at 2 o'clock.  So that's so in the morning we will be

          15       able to see if there are matters we need to deal with

          16       for the week ahead.

          17           You will start at 2 o'clock through to about 4.30 or

          18       thereabouts whenever a convenient moment for the witness

          19       and Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, 10.30 to 1.00, 2.00 to

          20       4.30.  Then on Friday we will be dealing with legal

          21       matters again so you will not be sitting on Fridays.

          22           That's the way we are proposing to go.

          23           It may be that there will have to be some alteration

          24       to that but please you can begin certainly to plan your

          25       own personal lives around the basis, certainly for




           1       a number of weeks, you will be able to have Fridays --

           2       you will not be sitting on a Friday.  There may come

           3       a time, we'll see how it goes, that we will have to look

           4       at that again but certainly for the next few weeks that

           5       will be the position here.

           6           You will understand that sitting there, it sounds

           7       quite easy, 10.30 -- there have been a lot of press

           8       publicity about how short hours lawyers work.  They

           9       don't, actually, there's an enormous amount of work that

          10       goes on all around that day and, believe you me, being

          11       a judge dealing with jurors for many years now, to sit

          12       here and concentrate on witness' evidence for two hours,

          13       two and a half hours is quite long enough.  So I do not

          14       want you feeling tired, losing concentration because

          15       that obviously would not be justice being done as well.

          16           So that's the framework of the days.  As you know

          17       you will have, sitting to your right, the juror usher

          18       and bailiff and he will be available if there's any

          19       problems at all.

          20           It's thought the hearing will last about eight,

          21       nine, ten weeks, something like that.  It may go shorter

          22       than that, please do not be disappointed if that

          23       happens.  It may go a little bit longer we are going to

          24       have to see how it goes.  There may be a little delay to

          25       start for you hearing evidence.  It may be on Monday




           1       afternoon that you will be hearing evidence for the

           2       first time but we will see how it goes.

           3           What is important, that we are dealing with a case

           4       of complexity and seriousness and we all want you to be,

           5       as I say, as comfortable there, able to concentrate and

           6       listen to all that's being asked of by the barristers

           7       and answered by the witness.

           8           Now, as I say, the opening that I am going to really

           9       supervise, if I can put it that way, is divided into two

          10       parts.  The first is the one I have just given you,

          11       dealing with the warnings that I must give to you, how

          12       to conduct yourselves as jurors of this Inquest.

          13           As I say, I've asked you not to discuss the case or

          14       the facts.  You really haven't been told very much about

          15       that at all as yet by me because I am not going to tell

          16       you.  That's going to happen tomorrow.  Mr Underwood is

          17       going to open the facts of the case from the

          18       prosecution.  He will no doubt repeat some of the things

          19       I have said by way of warning, but also will be able to

          20       give you a much fuller -- will be giving you a much

          21       fuller version of what the witnesses will say when they

          22       come to give their evidence then.

          23           But I think that probably, as you find yourself in

          24       a very new position as jurors, I think it probably

          25       better, rather than me to call on him to start now,




           1       I think we'll leave that all over until tomorrow

           2       morning.

           3           So it will probably you, Mr Underwood, most of the

           4       morning to tell the jury your opening?

           5   MR UNDERWOOD:  Yes, I should think an hour and a half or two

           6       at least.

           7   THE ASSISTANT CORONER:  That's what we have in store for

           8       tomorrow morning.  We'll see where we go to after that

           9       in due course.  But for the moment then, in a few

          10       moments time, I will be asking you to leave us and to be

          11       ready to start again at 10.30 tomorrow.  So I'm sorry we

          12       start off with all those warnings, ringing in your ears,

          13       you wonder what you are able to do.  But it is

          14       an important task you're doing and it's right that

          15       I have to set out those requirements of you.  They are

          16       requirements of me as well, and it's important,

          17       obviously, that we, as a team, work together on our

          18       respective roles within this Inquest.

          19           So thank you very much for listening so patiently

          20       and attentively to me.  So I'll ask you now, with the

          21       jury bailiffs to conduct you from court and if you would

          22       like to follow -- I think the entry and exit from court

          23       is going to be by me, so if you would like to come

          24       through that door again and we'll meet again tomorrow

          25       morning.



          13             (The Inquest adjourned until 10.30 am on

          14                   Tuesday, 17 September 2013)